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	<title>Comments on: The Sacrament of Failure</title>
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	<description>Change Revolution</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 22 May 2012 20:38:00 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: isaac</title>
		<link>http://philcooke.com/sacrament_of_failure/#comment-4860</link>
		<dc:creator>isaac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://philcooke.vintom.com/sacrament_of_failure#comment-4860</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Phil, i couldn&#039;t agree more about &#039;Walmartization&#039;!&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I looked across my church this sunday and saw a group of people all worshipping God, and enjoying it, now that is awesome, but i really felt the need for MORE people, and not a &#039;recycled&#039; group (though i understand Christians do need &#039;re-charging&#039;) we need people that are still &#039;effing and jeffing&#039; (british term for cussing!), people that still aren&#039;t totally there, we need the druggies, the pushers, the pimps the prostitutes, the lazy and lonely, the down-and-outs and the rich and famous and the barely saved&#039;s. it&#039;s like an anti-venom needs the venom for it to work! i had a thought that wouldn&#039;t it be a great thing to meet all these people and have them as guests in our home? as i thought my mind was frantically thinking of ways to get people through the doors (give-aways, free buses, encouraging he church to bring, university parties, gigs etc), but everything drew to blanks of &#039;we tried that&#039; or &#039;will that actually work... i mean who actually looks at flyers, i don&#039;t&#039; (ha ha!) i feel the responsability weighing on my shoulders, as a media designer, as a human and Christian...&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;we need to start failing some new ideas, and we need to do it fast. people are totally depending on you being their bible and communicating God. it&#039;s an individual thing, not just a church wide responsibility, we can&#039;t leave it to the leaders and new / young guys to &#039;bring in the bacon&#039;, we&#039;ve gotta get real and get our neighbours round for meals, take families out to lunch, and not those that can pay you back with a meal, ones that can&#039;t do that for the time, or for the cost.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;man, 1%. that&#039;s it? wow. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&#160;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&#160;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phil, i couldn&#39;t agree more about &#39;Walmartization&#39;!</p>
<p>I looked across my church this sunday and saw a group of people all worshipping God, and enjoying it, now that is awesome, but i really felt the need for MORE people, and not a &#39;recycled&#39; group (though i understand Christians do need &#39;re-charging&#39;) we need people that are still &#39;effing and jeffing&#39; (british term for cussing!), people that still aren&#39;t totally there, we need the druggies, the pushers, the pimps the prostitutes, the lazy and lonely, the down-and-outs and the rich and famous and the barely saved&#39;s. it&#39;s like an anti-venom needs the venom for it to work! i had a thought that wouldn&#39;t it be a great thing to meet all these people and have them as guests in our home? as i thought my mind was frantically thinking of ways to get people through the doors (give-aways, free buses, encouraging he church to bring, university parties, gigs etc), but everything drew to blanks of &#39;we tried that&#39; or &#39;will that actually work&#8230; i mean who actually looks at flyers, i don&#39;t&#39; (ha ha!) i feel the responsability weighing on my shoulders, as a media designer, as a human and Christian&#8230;</p>
<p>we need to start failing some new ideas, and we need to do it fast. people are totally depending on you being their bible and communicating God. it&#39;s an individual thing, not just a church wide responsibility, we can&#39;t leave it to the leaders and new / young guys to &#39;bring in the bacon&#39;, we&#39;ve gotta get real and get our neighbours round for meals, take families out to lunch, and not those that can pay you back with a meal, ones that can&#39;t do that for the time, or for the cost.</p>
<p>man, 1%. that&#39;s it? wow. </p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
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		<title>By: Bart Breen</title>
		<link>http://philcooke.com/sacrament_of_failure/#comment-4861</link>
		<dc:creator>Bart Breen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://philcooke.vintom.com/sacrament_of_failure#comment-4861</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Often times Church Growth is simply moving the sheep from one pen to another.  Churches in growing areas may flatter themselves that they are growing for many different reasons.  Sadly, when you do the analysis, a lot of them are growing because of transfer growth of new people moving in to the area who are already church-goers.  Further, they&#039;re growing at a rate below the demographic growth in the region which means that they&#039;re really not growing in a manner that benefits the kingdom at all.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;It&#039;s an arbitrary number but, I&#039;ve found it helpful to figure that if a Church&#039;s growth is not at least 30% from new converts, then it&#039;s not really all that helpful.  If a church in a high growth demographic area is not keeping pace with the area growth or channeling some of that growth into Church Plants, then they are impeding progress even if their numbers are going up.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;It&#039;s not enough to just put butts in seats.  Sure you have to start there and it has its part.  There has to be an awareness of what is going on around you in the community and a willingness to not flaunt numbers as success.  The types of numbers and what that represents for the Kingdom at large trumps all else in that realm.  Of course too, there are times when God&#039;s measure of success will be qualitative and not quantitative.  The Great Commission though clearly involves numbers.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Often times Church Growth is simply moving the sheep from one pen to another.  Churches in growing areas may flatter themselves that they are growing for many different reasons.  Sadly, when you do the analysis, a lot of them are growing because of transfer growth of new people moving in to the area who are already church-goers.  Further, they&#39;re growing at a rate below the demographic growth in the region which means that they&#39;re really not growing in a manner that benefits the kingdom at all.</p>
<p>It&#39;s an arbitrary number but, I&#39;ve found it helpful to figure that if a Church&#39;s growth is not at least 30% from new converts, then it&#39;s not really all that helpful.  If a church in a high growth demographic area is not keeping pace with the area growth or channeling some of that growth into Church Plants, then they are impeding progress even if their numbers are going up.</p>
<p>It&#39;s not enough to just put butts in seats.  Sure you have to start there and it has its part.  There has to be an awareness of what is going on around you in the community and a willingness to not flaunt numbers as success.  The types of numbers and what that represents for the Kingdom at large trumps all else in that realm.  Of course too, there are times when God&#39;s measure of success will be qualitative and not quantitative.  The Great Commission though clearly involves numbers.</p>
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		<title>By: Linda Bailey</title>
		<link>http://philcooke.com/sacrament_of_failure/#comment-4862</link>
		<dc:creator>Linda Bailey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://philcooke.vintom.com/sacrament_of_failure#comment-4862</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&quot;Fail big&quot;... I like it!&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I am currently in the initial stages of &#039;attempting&#039; a church plant.  Although I live in Australia I believe our church statistics are very similar to the US.  It is very reassuring to hear someone as experienced as you encouraging people to dream big, even if there is the possibility of failure.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I wonder whether our lack of trying new adventures stems from a lack of faith.  If we truly believed that God loves us, no matter what we do, then we would be more willing to take bigger risks to help build His kingdom. &lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&quot;Fail big&quot;&#8230; I like it!</p>
<p>I am currently in the initial stages of &#39;attempting&#39; a church plant.  Although I live in Australia I believe our church statistics are very similar to the US.  It is very reassuring to hear someone as experienced as you encouraging people to dream big, even if there is the possibility of failure.</p>
<p>I wonder whether our lack of trying new adventures stems from a lack of faith.  If we truly believed that God loves us, no matter what we do, then we would be more willing to take bigger risks to help build His kingdom. </p>
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		<title>By: isaac</title>
		<link>http://philcooke.com/sacrament_of_failure/#comment-4863</link>
		<dc:creator>isaac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://philcooke.vintom.com/sacrament_of_failure#comment-4863</guid>
		<description>probably a mixture of that and laziness, and over-busying ourselves. i can put my hand up and say i&#039;ve been in all those categories!  and yep, it&#039;s not just about bums on seats, it&#039;s depth and breadth, and that IS possible but at a lot of hard work. i forgot to mention this in my post, and you&#039;re most definitely right! all of these people need planting in a house that will grow them!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>probably a mixture of that and laziness, and over-busying ourselves. i can put my hand up and say i&#39;ve been in all those categories!  and yep, it&#39;s not just about bums on seats, it&#39;s depth and breadth, and that IS possible but at a lot of hard work. i forgot to mention this in my post, and you&#39;re most definitely right! all of these people need planting in a house that will grow them!</p>
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		<title>By: Ralph</title>
		<link>http://philcooke.com/sacrament_of_failure/#comment-4864</link>
		<dc:creator>Ralph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://philcooke.vintom.com/sacrament_of_failure#comment-4864</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;this is a stimulating thread.  i have always thought we never really answer the  question of why we open the doors of our churches.  only when we can answer that question, can we design a service that reaches out, or design a ministry that is effective.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&#160;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;the quote above &quot;it&#039;s like an anti-venom needs the venom for it to work!&quot; is an interesting thought. if we aren&#039;t living in the world where people are hurting and struggling, then we are just recycling people on Sunday mornings with different version of the same thing.  or with a 1% church, we are  truly rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. &lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>this is a stimulating thread.  i have always thought we never really answer the  question of why we open the doors of our churches.  only when we can answer that question, can we design a service that reaches out, or design a ministry that is effective.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>the quote above &quot;it&#39;s like an anti-venom needs the venom for it to work!&quot; is an interesting thought. if we aren&#39;t living in the world where people are hurting and struggling, then we are just recycling people on Sunday mornings with different version of the same thing.  or with a 1% church, we are  truly rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. </p>
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		<title>By: Sue in Denver</title>
		<link>http://philcooke.com/sacrament_of_failure/#comment-4865</link>
		<dc:creator>Sue in Denver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://philcooke.vintom.com/sacrament_of_failure#comment-4865</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Phil, please answer a bigger question that comes to mind. How do we present and manage failure in the public eye?? This seems to be the issue Charismatics as a whole, and TV personalities specifically, have the hardest time with, Joyce being one obvious exception. I think her transparency disarms people who can relate to her in success and in mistakes.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;But, how do we convince our leaders and &quot;personalities&quot; that communicating failures or mistakes does not hurt their image, but may actually help it? The fear I think is that somehow admitting that anything doesn&#039;t go according to plan is a faith failure. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I would appreciate any input!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phil, please answer a bigger question that comes to mind. How do we present and manage failure in the public eye?? This seems to be the issue Charismatics as a whole, and TV personalities specifically, have the hardest time with, Joyce being one obvious exception. I think her transparency disarms people who can relate to her in success and in mistakes.</p>
<p>But, how do we convince our leaders and &quot;personalities&quot; that communicating failures or mistakes does not hurt their image, but may actually help it? The fear I think is that somehow admitting that anything doesn&#39;t go according to plan is a faith failure. </p>
<p>I would appreciate any input!</p>
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		<title>By: buule Joshua</title>
		<link>http://philcooke.com/sacrament_of_failure/#comment-4866</link>
		<dc:creator>buule Joshua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://philcooke.vintom.com/sacrament_of_failure#comment-4866</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Well Phil, i feel this message about the idea for change it really important if we are to have churches grow and Christians reaching out to the other non-believing poputlation.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;despite that fact that usually those in the &quot;big positions &quot; will be satisfied with the status Quo, in fear of losing their positions; i feel its better for failures to be exposed through communication because this will open our attention towards the sole cause of the failure and we shall be able to state new strategies towards effecting the new ideas that might have failed.&quot; the best way to stop a bad tree from growing is by cutting it from the roots&quot; unless we realize the roots to the problems (failures) in the church we can hardly eliminate them or even integrate new ideas into the church. &lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well Phil, i feel this message about the idea for change it really important if we are to have churches grow and Christians reaching out to the other non-believing poputlation.</p>
<p>despite that fact that usually those in the &quot;big positions &quot; will be satisfied with the status Quo, in fear of losing their positions; i feel its better for failures to be exposed through communication because this will open our attention towards the sole cause of the failure and we shall be able to state new strategies towards effecting the new ideas that might have failed.&quot; the best way to stop a bad tree from growing is by cutting it from the roots&quot; unless we realize the roots to the problems (failures) in the church we can hardly eliminate them or even integrate new ideas into the church. </p>
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		<title>By: dsad</title>
		<link>http://philcooke.com/sacrament_of_failure/#comment-4867</link>
		<dc:creator>dsad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://philcooke.vintom.com/sacrament_of_failure#comment-4867</guid>
		<description>&lt;p style=&quot;margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt&quot; class=&quot;MsoNormal&quot;&gt;&lt;span&gt;&lt;font face=&quot;Times New Roman&quot; size=&quot;3&quot;&gt;If you have bought gold from others before, you may know that the deliver time of &lt;/font&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.euwowgold.com/&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;&lt;font face=&quot;Times New Roman&quot; size=&quot;3&quot;&gt;wow gold&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;font size=&quot;3&quot;&gt;&lt;font face=&quot;Times New Roman&quot;&gt; is too long.^_^&lt;span&gt;  &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style=&quot;margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt&quot; class=&quot;MsoNormal&quot;&gt;&lt;span&gt;&lt;font face=&quot;Times New Roman&quot; size=&quot;3&quot;&gt;We farm the&lt;strong&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.meinwowgold.de/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;WOW gold&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/strong&gt; by manual, no bots, no cheats, no hacks. We have the 24*7*365 Online Support.&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt" class="MsoNormal"><span><font face="Times New Roman" size="3">If you have bought gold from others before, you may know that the deliver time of </font><a href="http://www.euwowgold.com/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow"><strong><font face="Times New Roman" size="3">wow gold</font></strong></a><font size="3"></font><font face="Times New Roman"> is too long.^_^<span>  </span></font></span></p>
<p style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt" class="MsoNormal"><span><font face="Times New Roman" size="3">We farm the<strong><a href="http://www.meinwowgold.de/" rel="nofollow">WOW gold</a></strong> by manual, no bots, no cheats, no hacks. We have the 24*7*365 Online Support.</font></span></p>
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