Phil Cooke

I think the answer would be “No we don’t need this!”  Americans have plenty of Bibles. Anyway, Thomas Jefferson already made one of these by cutting out all the miracles and super natural events from the Bible (The Jefferson Bible).  I’m still a bit weary of God and country nationalism.  Seems like we make our history a little to simplistic.  We had some great Christian leaders and some. . . well some regular people as well.   

I would liken the desire for America to be a theocracy to Isreal’s desire to have a king. That’s all.

We need this bible for the very reason of these comments.  We need to remember that our nation WAS founded by imperfect men and women that served a perfect God that had a perfect plan.  Part of that plan was stated in the Mayflower Compact and was the goal of many who came to this country – to have freedom to worship as they choose, and to spread the Gospel to a new land.  God has blessed America because America has, in its history, spread the Word of God throughout all nations.  Why do we need this Bible?  Because if we don’t get over this “separation of church and state” non-sense then our future is lost.  Are we a Christian nation?  In principle – Yes, and we always have been.  If the church does not impact the state then the church is dead.

Why does this Bible not include all the attrocities that have occurred throughout American history?  Because that is not the point of the Bible.  It does not ignore the attrocities, and gives proper place and recognition to those brave men and women in American history that have stood up against evil.  To say that this Bible is lacking because it doesn’t cover atttrocities is disingenuous at best and deceitful at worst.  This Bible is about how the Scriptures have been influencial in our nation.  This Bible is about how this nation is, in principle, a nation built upon a Judeo/Christian ethic that comes from Scripture.  We need to remember that.  These comments are exactly why we need this Bible.

To say that this Bible, in any way – shape – or form supports a theocracy is ignorance.  I don’t mean that to be rude, but it is a statement from ignorance of this Bible, this editor, or this publisher.  Christians, with any sense of patriotism, want freedom of religion – all religions.  That is how we protect our own religious freedoms.  Is this the definition of theocracy?  Of course not.  However, that does not mean that being a Christian nation, in principle (meaning the morals of Scripture are what guide our morals as a nation), is forcing Christianity on anyone.  It is saying that we are to be good, kind, loving, moral people at the heart of our nation.  How can that be compared to Israel wanting a king?

Tim,

This is not a Study Bible and does not claim to be.  Again, this is NOT a study Bible but one that highlights the impact that Scripture has made upon this nation.  How is that a bad thing?  I don’t know if you know this, but there is an enourmous amount of ideology in Scripture.  It’s not about keeping ideology separate from Scripture.  It is about making sure that our ideology is completely in line with Scripture.  There again, this comment highlights the need for this type of Bible. 

I can’t believe what I’m reading. This Bible “gives proper place and recognition to those brave men and women in American history that have stood up against evil”. Why should the Bible do that? You are implying that their stories should be added to the Bible. Why not simply write a different book about them?

Let me ask you a question. Would you object to, for instance, to a British patriot’s Bible? Or how about an Iranian patriot’s Bible? There are Iranian Christians, and many Middle Eastern countries were Christian before Islam conquered them.

God is not American.

“It is about making sure that our ideology is completely in line with Scripture”.

So you are implying that the study notes in this Bible are the Holy Spirit inspired words of God, like the Bible?

I completely agree with the original poster who pointed out people use study notes to put across their own ideologies. I can cite numerous examples of this.

Simon,

Don’t blame the Bible or its commentaries for user error.  User error of Scripture has cause some of the worst attrocities known to mankind.  Some people will read what they want to read in a Bible, commentary or not.  The Bible does stand alone – no doubt – and always will.  No one even attempts to say that these additional stories are equal to Scripture.  Thanks for your interesting comments.

I wouldn’t say Bibles with commentaries alongside them are heresy, but personally I am not in favour of them for the reasons I have already outlined, and on that we shall simply have to agree to disagree.

Not everyone is as well educated as you appear to be, and there will be ignorant people who read the articles added into the American Patriot’s Bible (and other similar Bibles) thinking God has spoken to them “from scripture”. I have seen this happen again and again with other Bibles that contain anything more than simple footnotes, and it is particularly insidious when the commentators interpretation is clearly at odds with what the Bible actually says.

If I might weigh in…

I’m personally not opposed to study Bibles; I think many can be helpful as a quick reference, especially as regards historical or cultural context.  However, I think you hit on an important point: do your own work first when studying Scripture.  Commentators are generally speaking very well educated and compentent in their fields.  However, they are still just men, and many well respected evangelical scholars disagree on a lot of things.  Though their motives are (hopefully) good, we ought not simply trust them in what they say.

I cringe slightly every time I hear or read that the “United States is a Christian nation.” I wholeheartedly agree that this nation was founded upon Judeo-Christian principles but we are not a theocracy.  Saying we are a Christian nation implies that religious clerics, or in our case, pastors and priests, are calling the shots – like is done in Iran or other Muslin nations.

In my opinion, I think the founders of our nation wanted to create an environment where religion was able to be practiced freely without fear or prosecution. In centuries past in England you could be imprisoned or executed simply because you were not Catholic or were not Protestant, depending on who was the king or queen at the time. In the Soviet Union you could be sent to prison or a labor camp because of religious involvement. Thomas Jefferson, in the letter he wrote to a friend about the separation of church and state was concerned about this type of action. Liberals today take it out of context by claiming it means religious people should not be in official positions or talk about faith in public settings. Our founding fathers were not concerned about faith being expressed in political or public settings nearly as much as they were the persecution, not by other citizens, but by government itself for such religious beliefs and expression of them.

No, no, and no.

If there were a “need” for this type of information, the proper thing to do would have been to write a book (not publish a Bible) about American History, and use scripture to back it up as needed. 

This book, inserting American-centrist “patriotism” (including war) into the holy scriptures is an abomination. My furthere thoughts are found here.

“It is about making sure that our ideology is completely in line with Scripture.” Why must American ideology be “in line” with Scripture? And what of those Americans for whom the Scriptures mean nothing? Our founding Fathers fled Europe at a time when religion was  being imposed on them, and their intent for this country was religious freedom. There are patriots who won’t be believers.

You are pretending that you do not know the word “patriot” is incendiary. Loaded. I should point out to you that the church should keep its ideology to itself and leave the nation alone. Jesus did that during his ministry, and for his entire life kept his ideology away from the Roman occupation and did not for one moment interfere in politics.

Listen to the words folks are speaking to you in this thread and stop being an apologist for the division and bigotry this bible is attempting to ramp up..

I must agree with you and the above comments-there’s entirely too much “God and country nationalsim” in our churches. I too felt it wise to leave a church just after an election because of the (implied) voting preference of the congregation. We don’t need this Bible.

Unfortunately, this “Bible” reflects both the inability of a large segment of evangelicalism to keep nationalism in its proper perspective, and evangelicals’ willingness to equate patriotism (the “God ‘n country” mindset) with Biblical truth.

It doesn’t surprise me that is has been published or that it is in its second printing.  And among Christian conservatives and fundamentalists I’m sure it is finding a receptive audience.  They probably look at people like me and question my spirituality (as well as my patriotism) because I think it’s a crock.

To me this is akin to the western materialistic mindset that has influenced so much of evangelicalism in the last thirty years.  We don’t know who we are as people of God; therefore we’re prone to allowing ourselves to be labeled based on temporal norms that objectify non-Biblical concepts.  It’s just another sad manifestation of cultural Christianity.  

Specialized Bibles are fine – we’ve seen a number of them in recent years.  But when the commentary and content is extra-Biblical and agenda-driven, something’s wrong.  Dr. Lee should have just written a book and left the Bible out of it. 

Sigh…

What’s fascinating about this is that it seems to have brought full-circle the conflation of American patriotism and spirituality.  For a long time, well-meaning and often ill-informed believers have sought to co-opt the 18th-century religious and political beliefs of a good number of our founding fathers into a 20th and 21st century understanding of Evangelical Christianity.  Now it seems that some would like to co-opt scripture into 21st-century notions of patriotism [read that "conservative patriotism].

This seems the ultimate example of mis-guided proof-texting.

In my (never-ending) quest for a new bible, I have came across this bible at Mardels.  I flipped through it for a few minutes.  My first impression of this bible was… “Why?”  Why would someone publish a bible like this?  I set it back on the shelf and moved on.  I am STILL searching for the right bible for me.